F07 electric seat upgrade with memory switch?

[Kopfjaeger]

Does anyone know if the electric front seat positions are stored in the position switch, or associated control module?  My F07 only has 'memory' positions for the driver seat only (option codes S459 - seat adjustment,, S481 - Sports seats and S488 - Lumber support, both seats). I would like to have this feature on the front passenger seat. I don't think it's an option from the factory, but thinking about an 'upgrade'.

The only other seat option I can see is S459, comfort seats, which have side and thigh bolster adjustment and different seat switches. I'm not after that, just the memory positioning aspect.  There is a passenger seat memory switch (part No 61319361183).

My reasoning is, if the 'position' data is stored in the seat module (in the seat) or switch, then I will need an appropriate module (possibly an LHD driver seat module?) and switch, plus interconnecting wiring to upgrade the existing seat.

The most draconian option would be a LHD drivers seat to replace the current passenger seat and a LHD door card🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣.

It's a 'dead' idea, if the information is stored in one of the main control modules as I doubt the option exists to code for a passenger memory switch, if it isn't offered as an option.

I've done some digging through Realoem and it looks like the information is stored in the seat switch, to be used in conjunction with the door card memory switch. The bad news is BMW don't offer a seat switch with my options.... 🙄

I can get a switch that should work, but I get extra buttons, that won't work 🤣. That doesn't work for my 'OCD'. The memory switch costs about £150 and the seat switch costs about £250. That excludes the connecting wiring between seat switch and the door card memory switch...

The other option is to source some 'comfort seats' in Veneto beige....probably a bit like finding unicorn eggs on my front lawn🤣🤣🤣🤣.

[Kopfjaeger]

It's occurred to me this morning, that the solution would be to use a LHD version of a seat control with options for S459 and S488 for sport seats. Effectively, the mirror image of the drivers seat.

So the only question to resolve is if there is any coding that might be required....if it's just localised wiring between the seat control and memory switch.....happy days....

I just need to decide if I want to spend £400 on an idea that might work...🤣🤣🤣🤣

[skyjawa]

Can’t answer your questions, but I guess I have unicorn eggs on my drive as I have comfort seats in Veneto beige 😂 Both sides have seat memory.

if there’s anything I can look up in Bimmercode that may help let me know….

 

[Steve84N]

You can get the memory switch on ebay for far less than new. I actually had some Veneto Beige comfort seats for sale last year after I changed direction to use an M5 interior... 

It's not the work of a moment to do something like this, both extra wiring and coding is required. I don't know if it's possible to just add passenger memory to your seats. I went from what you have (less lumbar) to M5 comfort seats and the big plug was wired totally differently on the driver's side. Passenger side needed new wiring running to the door. Then you have to change the vehicle order and write the correct code to the modules. 

I would suggest speaking to someone who does BMW retrofits, they will have a better idea of what's possible. I used someone called Samy PC on Facebook. I went to see him in Birmingham and he did the wiring and coding. Then later he remote coded my 6WA instrument cluster. 

[Kopfjaeger]

Gents, thanks for the feedback.  I'm happy to keep the sports seats, as in I don't want option S456. 

My tiny brain is convinced that using an LHD drive seat switch in conjunction with an LHD memory switch and associated interconnecting wiring should work.  This approach would be flawed if any signalling is routed into a controller in the dash.....There is a risk that both switches would want to use the same memory address and thus create an error....

I was wondering if there was someone here that had knowledge of the low level coding (as in machine code at BIOS level) as opposed to the manual coding options of E-sys, etc.  I'm sure that somewhere on this mudball, that some tech savy individual  knows this.... To be honest, more likely in the States or Germany.....

Or if someone as mad as me, has already done this upgrade.....🤣🤣🤣🤣.

The seed is sown and it may become a project for me in 2024.  I will look out for parts, second hand on ebay here, plus Germany and the Baltic states.... 

Having said that, if I come across some veneto beige comfort seats with lumbar support (2015-2017) that aren't insanely expensive that is a secondary option.😁

[Steve84N]

I have a feeling there's wiring that goes to the ZGW module in the dashboard... 

[Kopfjaeger]

@Steve84N, using a well known online resource, I've ascertained the seat modules route communications via the ZGW to the FRM. So a temporary stumbling block.

There may be a workable solution, though.

Based on my experience of installing 'top view' (3AH) on my F07, using a TRSVC 5DL box, it can be coded in. The car would accept 3AG rear camera, when I fitted that to my car, but wouldn't accept 3AH, when I subsequently installed the extra cameras. It was fixed by coding as 5DL. In ISTA, my TRSVC has camera missing errors, but that doesn't trigger any faults in the car, so can be ignored.

So the same might apply if the FRM is coded for S459....

More investigation is required 😁.

[Steve84N]

Good luck on your journey of discovery, should be quite a cheap thing to try if you get the switches second hand. 

I paid around £400 for the comfort seats but they were a bit grotty. 

[Kopfjaeger]

On my journey of discovery🤣, it appears that on some models, including mine for 2016, the seat memory switch has the word 'Set' instead of the more commonly used M🙄. So another order of magnitude to complicate matters🤣

Anyone else have seat memory switch with 'Set' and not 'M'?

[Kopfjaeger]

Attached is the switch in my car and the sole example seen to date on Ebay.

The ebay shot also shows that the switch can also have a colour coded surround🤣🤣🤣.  I think I'm in this for the long haul.....

[skyjawa]

Mine is a 2011 with the M not set, but my panel looks the same as the second picture, the colour coded surround!

[Kopfjaeger]

Thanks @skyjawa....I always have the option of swapping my drivers side switch with an 'M' switch and colour coded to make it easier for sourcing the passenger door, but that grates my OCD.......

I haven't reached the point yet of giving up on a passenger switch, in black with 'Set'😁....its a long game now I think, unless I come across what I seek on ebay.

I doubt my local dealer would have the part No, I require. I'm not prepared to take the drivers door card off before the Spring to check the part number directly, to track down the 'passenger door equivalent' 

The memory switch would be about £150? new, so not expensive imo, for what it could deliver....

However the 'fly in the ointment' is the door card.  If I don't cut the aperture perfectly, a new door card will be £1100 + 😳.

So no pressure🤣🤣🤣🤣, just a very challenging upgrade.

[Kopfjaeger]

I've just seen a car on ebay, same year and interior colours as mine with passenger seat memory and heated rear seats.....the downside is the £12.6k to get those parts🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

[Steve84N]

Got a link? 

[Kopfjaeger]

@Steve84N oops, it was autotrader🙄

With 130k miles on the clock.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-details/202305307934665?sort=price-asc&advertising-location=at_cars&make=BMW&model=5 Series Gran Turismo&postcode=N14 7LA&price-from=12000&price-to=15000&year-from=2016&year-to=2016&fromsra

 

[Steve84N]

It's only got passenger seat memory because those are the comfort seats. 

[Kopfjaeger]

@Steve84N....it has memory switches for both front seats. The switches can be seen on both doors, although only there is only a close up photo of the drivers door. They are comfort seats without lumbar support.

[Steve84N]

That circular button is lumbar support. My point was, I don't think there's any cars with normal seats and passenger memory. You only got it with comfort seats. 

[Kopfjaeger]

@Steve84N, thanks, I missed the Lumber support button in the photo.

It seems odd to me that comfort seats have adjustable side bolsters, but sport seats don't.

I've found a switch on Ebay, with the correct text (from a LHD 2014model). At £30, it might be worth a punt.

I'm trying to understand the wiring diagrams to see if there is a work around to the coding 459 option. According to a wiring diagram, attached, there is LIN bus wiring between the seat modules. There are seat modules for the drivers side and passengers side.

The village idiot in me is wondering if looping the new memory seat switch into the LIN bus ring that includes the drivers seat will sort the connectivity.

It should be possible to jury rig a connection, by removing the drivers side terminal from say the FRM module, adding in the new seat memory switch and connecting back into the FRM module to make the LIN bus complete.  If the LIN bus just acts as a routing communication between seat controls and seat memory switch....this should work?  If it doesn't, then maybe coding SA459, might make it work, although some errors might be generated.  If it does work, then the door card can be cut to take the switch. If it doesn't then its just the £30 for the switch plus coding SA459 and my time.

When I retrofitted top view to my car, I bought the front door wiring looms from an F10 M5, to get the HSD cables for the cameras...So I've possibly got the switch wiring I need for the door card to the body. All I will need is wiring from there to the FRM/JBE to add the switch to the LIN bus.

It will be a PITA, as my FRM module is at the base of the A pillar on the drivers side and the cable connectors are really short, so b****y difficult to work on🙄. I've got the pins and crimps....I just need some appropriate coloured wire for the LIN bus extension......

Sounds like a plan, if I buy the switch😁. So I might have a Spring project....

[Kopfjaeger]

I forgot to add that item 44 is the drivers side seat module. And the JBE module also needs to be included in my wiring modification....the bus is a two wire protocol between modules.😁

[Kopfjaeger]

So, by way of an update, I've bought a door card seat memory switch, with the correct lettering.

The seat control module for comfort seating (SA459) is a type 61359459675, which fits my car and several other models.

Once I get the switch, I'll strip it down to see what is on the PCB. If there aren't any chips, e.g. EPROM/PROMs (?) Then it means no data is stored in the switch, so likely to be in the seat module.

As there aren't different types of FRM/JBE modules for my car, they must just be interfaces for wiring. As well as the wiring for the LIN bus connectivity between the modules, there might be some 'soft' routing that happens on these modules that the SA459 coding implements.

I'll need to study the wiring diagrams again.

If I can access the passenger and drivers seat ECU and connectors without removing the seat, I can compare the wiring.  If the modules are identical, then there is a strong possibility that installing the new switch and wiring between switch and seat ECU and LIN bus connectivity will give me what I need, assuming there is an unused terminal for the 'passenger seat' in the FRM and JBE.

If that is the case, the plan is to replicate the wiring and see if the switch works. I won't cut the door card, until its checked.

If it doesn't work, then, SA459 will need to be coded to the Car. If that doesn't work.

Then it looks like I'll need to change at least one seat ECU, if not both for the SA459 to 'work' and give me both seats with memory positioning. This might throw up some non critical error codes, but I'm not worried about that.

Any comments or ideas would be appreciated😁

[Steve84N]

You're beyond my level of knowledge, think you might be on your own... 🤔

[Kopfjaeger]

Probably. I'm currently trying to reference the wiring diagrams at the moment, but it's painful.The passenger door switch S23 connects to the door wiring with a four pin plug. I have this wiring, left over from door looms bought for my top view upgrade.The door switch should be with me by next week latest.

So currently I'm out of the door and into the body. I will need a cable to extend the X5*1B Lin bus line from the switch into the FRM. What I can't find atm is the plug/pin-out reference to use on the FRM.

Worst case, I use the drivers side, as an initial reference. I'm assuming in my naivety, there will be an unused pin on the FRM which I can connect to. I want to avoid piggy backing onto the drivers lin bus connection to the FRM if possible.

I will also check to see if the seat modules are the same. The passenger module is known as the SMFB, with the driver's being SMFA. If they're identical, I won't need a module change. If they're different, then I'll need to replace the existing passenger module the same type as the drivers side. Looking through RealOEM, there doesn't appear to be a distinction between passenger or driver seat modules. There appears to be only two types of module currently available, for comfort seating or comfort seating with electrically adjusted rear seats. All the non comfort option modules are discontinued, but there are 4 types🙄, of which previous versions have all been superseded by 61359459673. This module, new is €180+VAT from WOX. I should be able to source a 2nd hand version online, although at the moment, the photos of the model No doesn't match the descriptions.

So some progress has been made.😁

[Kopfjaeger]

Whilst I'm waiting for the switch to arrive, I'm pinging terminals on my donor wiring loom to see where the pins need to go in the door connector.

It's also given me time to think. Does anyone know, if I swap out a seat module, does the new one need coding in, or registering to the VIN?. I know the head unit and TCB are coded to the VIN and there are some security aspects in the architecture.

I've only added the TRSVC module to the Car previously and got the 3AG added to the VO, by someone who codes. When I upgraded to '3AH'  the car wouldn't take it, but it took 5DL and it works. There are errors for the missing cameras, but it doesn't impede any aspect of operation...

So just want to be prepared  if I need to swap out a seat module.

I'm not looking forward to adding the new wiring/termination into the FRM module...its a real PITA to access and the connectors are on 'short' looms...there isn't much play to get the connectors fitted, as the loom is so tightly bunched.....

Still, it's my own fault for liking a challenge🙄

[Steve84N]

My M5 seats use a different module, it didn't need registering to the VIN but the car does need coding. You have to change the vehicle order and have the correct CAFD files uploaded. This is what I had Samy PC do for me, plus the wiring.