BMW E39 - FUTURE CLASSIC?

[MichaelE39]

Been hearing for many years now that the BMW E39 is a 'future classic', and consequently that prices will begin to rise. Well, I bought my E39 530i 2002 nearly four years ago, and although I love it and treasure it I'm not seeing evidence of prices increasing just yet. Decent ones seem to be for sale currently for £6K to £8, which was pretty much the situation four years ago, as I recall. How do you guys see the situation?

 

[Calypso-E34]

That's a very good question.  I'm sure there will be many opinions on this, from people with more knowledge of the market than I have, but here's my take on it.

Every BMW 5 Series up to the E28 is now a de facto classic.  Most of the bad ones are gone, having rusted away, worn out, used for parts or whatever.  The E34 has moved up a lot in the four or five years since I had my last one - again, the bad ones are beginning to disappear now, and those that are left are beginning to go up in value.  The E34 M5 has gone stratospheric, and is dragging everything up with it - even the humble 520i.

The E39 is different from all the cars which have gone before, especially the post 2000 ones.  They get pretty needy in old age, and need constant looking after, mostly because of the volume of electronic bits that go wrong - that's my experience anyway.  The E39 M5 will always have a value, and values of that car are already also going through the roof and will always find homes, as will the Alpina 6 and 8 cylinder cars.  Beyond that, I think only the very best of the rest will see increases in value worthy of investment capital.  The less than perfect ones will disappear faster than the E34s did because they are more complex and demand more expenditure than most think they are worth.

The E39 was in its day the best car BMW had ever built by many expert's standards, and it was still winning awards even towards the end of its production life.  The best ones will always be wonderful cars.  I had an E39 530i, and I still think it was the nicest looking car I ever had - but it drove me mad - spent far too much time in the garage, and needed a laptop half the time to get to the bottom of things.  That was probably about 9 years ago now, when the car was 11 years old.  I wouldn't buy another one now that the youngest one is 20 years old.  I would however have another E34 in a heartbeat - anyone can fix them and there's not too much to go wrong.

So I could be wrong, but I would think that yes, the E39 is and will be recognised as a classic, but not necessarily a valuable one - and you have to weigh up the money you will spend keeping it working well, as that has to be offset against any potential increase in value. 

Edited September 29, 2023 by Calypso-E34

[Ray112]

E39 is going up in value slowly, but mostly that happens to very good examples only like low mileage, rare specification, V8 models, limited editions models etc. 

Obviously there's a big difference between future classic and old daily banger. Those, who keep shouting that their 530d with 200k miles and rotten sills are future classic, are plain idiots.

On other hand, those with well looked after v8 and other low mileage well looked after E39 might have something that's worth keeping for some years before selling, ideally not to use it as daily car to keep miles low as possible and park it in garage, not on street.

[Sharkfan]

Daily driver on 171k miles and going up nearly every single day...

...and left out in all weathers...

 

[Calypso-E34]

That’s a beauty. 

[Ray112]

Good point that it's Alpina. Being let's say basic specification 520i you probably won't get much more than 1.5k for it, and that's on a good day. Like I said rare models and if looked after (which I presume yours is) definitely will go up in value. Of course the lesser miles on it, the more valuable it is. 

[Steve VH]

A future classic? Most E39's have increased in value to what they were 10 years ago when depreciation bottomed out, and will probably increase in value over the next 10 years, particularly the desirable models. I don't foresee them rising to anything like the classic Fords of the 1970's and 80's, mainly because most of the Fords have rusted away to nothing.

A good E39 such as a 528i/530i is still a very drivable and reliable car, and infinitely preferable to a Cortina/ Granada/ Cavalier/ Carlton/ Rover.

[MichaelE39]

Thanks for your responses guys. Insightful and interesting as always.  Been thinking about likely current E39 values. For example, my E39 530i M Sport Individual in Techno Violet has just 63k mileage, 3 former owners and has excellent bodywork (no rust, dents, scratches). I’ve recently completed a three year comprehensive refresh (aimed at keeping it the reliable daily driver it is), including: All new cooling system and  air intake system, power steering reservoir and hoses, four new Pirelli P Zeros, new Light Control Module, new Hella headlight units fitted with Philips GT200 bulbs, new transmission selector switch, bonnet alarm, intense washer pump, air con overhaul and reg-gas etc, etc. plus good service history plus recent Inspection II.
I’d like to think it could sell it for £8K plus, but being a realist I’m thinking £6k plus. Any thoughts? (see profile for photo).

 

 

[Steve VH]

Seeing it is your daily driver, I wouldn't worry about any uplift in value, just continue to enjoy driving,  and owning what still remains to be one of the best cars to ever come out of the bmw stable.

Unless you are ready for a change of car?

[DennisCooper]

Hi,

This 'hot topic' !

Overall - Yes, the E39 will become a 'classic' BMW and there's also many many more cars from BMW and all the other marques that'll also become Classic's. 

However, it's a No, they won't be worth and 'Actually Sell' for big amounts in the future, along with almost all other similar cars. The exception will be totally original, timewarp condition, extremely low mileage, the right colour and spec with a massive maintenance file with every single invoice present for any work and parts needed. These cars will also most likely be M5's, or manual gearbox 540i's - perhaps the odd smattering of manual 530i especially in Touring format and saloons if the Champagne Editions. 

 

The reason is that there's just way too much stacked against the E39 and many most other cars and the 'automatic' response that they will 'rise in value in coming years' will gradually fade off as cars either will remain unsold at higher asking prices or will deteriorate to the point no one will want to pay 'big(ger) money for them. 

 

Aspects for a rise in values and asking prices in the next 10-15/20 years

1. Being widely accepted as one of the best BMW's ever made

2. The E39 M5

3. Alpina B10 V8S 

4. Bit of a longer shot, a Hartge H5 V8, AC Schnitzer S5, an MVR E39

5. If Synthetic Fuel becomes widely or at least, easily available throughout the UK.

 

Aspects for a decrease in values and asking prices in the next 10-15/20 years

1. Price of Petrol/Diesel if Synthetic fuels doesn't become widely or easily available. 

2. Petrol and Diesel in terms of the environment - leading to

3. More cities and towns implementing a ULEZ zone

4. More of the driving public moving to electric vehicles

5. Government adding or increases taxation on any parts to do with a fossil fueled engine

6. Government ramping up VED to perhaps double or triple of the price now

7. Government ramping up the cost of an MOT and making various items more stringent

8. Government bringing in a tax or levy on insuring a fossil fueled vehicle

9. Government changing the criteria for a 'classic car' in order not to pay VED

10. Less mechanical garages keeping the correct equipment/diagnostic tools etc 

11. Around the globe, very few people will want a right hand drive car, so exporting it away won't really be likely for most owners. 

12. Parts Availability - I'm a bit hesitant on listing this given there were 1.5 million E39's manufactured and the brands having to have kept spare parts for 10 years after end of production ( i think) 

13. Younger drivers just not interested in an 'old BMW'

14. Wider Cost of Living aspects - affecting the overall private car ownership market

 

Some of the very best examples of the sought after cars will perhaps exchange between car enthusiasts with the money and space to keep them. However the often cited mention of 'prices are only going one way' and 'future classic and will only appreciate' will become more muted and asking prices will take a downward trajectory. 

The Fast Fords rise I think will soon begin to tail off and selling prices will reduce as more of the current wealthier owners who have purchased on nostalgia (as their fathers had one in the 70s and 80's) begin to pass away - there isn't very many current 25-35 year olds in 10 years who will actively seek out a £100K Ford Sierra or Escort Mk2 etc and certainly even fewer currently 15-20 year olds will be looking to buy a £75K+ Ford as an 'investment'.

I of course may be totally wrong on all of that, If the UK does indeed get waves of investment and money in and much of the population gets the choice of highly paid jobs and flourishes fantastically well in the next 5+ years or so and lots of people will happily spend £15K on a 75K mile 2001 525i  and £40/50/60K on a nice M5! 

As already mentioned, enjoy the cars, drive them for what they are and while you can!

Cheers, Dennis!

[Sharkfan]

Not sure about a lot of the engines but while the E39 M5 is not ULEZ compatible both the Alpina B10 V8 and B10 3.3 definitely are. No info on the B10 3.2 or the B10 V8S yet.

[MichaelE39]

Hi Dennis (DennisCooper)

Wow, thanks! Great response, full of insights. Overall, I see the trends pretty much as you do.

A trawl through Autotrader, eBay, PistonHeads etc  indicates around £3K gets a high mileage average example, around £6K gets a high miler in very good condition, and around £8K gets a low mileage one with great provenance and in excellent nick. Above £8K is the realm of optimistic sellers and dealers.

E39’s still attract a lot of attention, and they are great to drive, but this comes at a price regarding maintenance / repairs. Ownership is probably best suited to capable weekend driveway mechanics (who have some likeminded mates) and who can buy their own parts and avoid labour charges and horrific parts mark-up at local garages. 

So, forget the ‘investment’ and ‘classic’ narrative; the E39 truly was ‘the ultimate driving machine’, but now is probably best thought of as ‘an old BMW’ that’s fun to drive, and to own if you’ve got the know-how to keep it running (or if you’ve got the money).

Interestingly, turns out my neighbours see me as ‘the old boy with the old car, who’s always under the bonnet’

Regards, Michael
 

 

[duncan-uk]

I find neighbours don't always "get" why you're tinkering, i generally make light and chat away ( i lke my neighbours) but sometimes i just want to be left alone. Its my mindful time.

[Dbcrd]

Another way of looking at it is a daily driver that doesn't depreciate much.  Yes I've probably spent quite a bit on my E39 but it probably isn't worth much less than I paid for it nearly 13 years ago and looks sort of reasonable from a distance.  Nobody has complained about me working on it on the driveway.

 

Edited September 2, 2023 by Dbcrd

[duncan-uk]

The neighbours don’t complain, they don’t care but sometimes feels like you have to justify what your doing when actually you just want to get on. 

[Sir Anthony Regents Park]

I've had E39's and drove them as new cars, but I can't get excited about them at all. I think of the rust, exploding header tanks, pixels, ABS modules etc etc etc and what an absolute pain in the arse they are to work on.

I always preferred the E34 tbh and the E60 is now more car for the £££. I feel the same about E46's as well. Meh.

[Syncrofred]

Well, you are in a definite minority group on here Sir Anthony.😇

[Steve VH]

I have to say the E34 is crap when compared to the 39, too heavy, very vague, wooly steering, so handled like a bag of shite in comparison to the E39.

[Calypso-E34]

17 minutes ago, Steve VH said:

I have to say the E34 is crap when compared to the 39, too heavy, very vague, wooly steering, so handled like a bag of shite in comparison to the E39.

Incorrect. 

[duncan-uk]

I’d take the rack and pinion of the e39 6 pots over an e34 box. I loved my e28 (same steering) but box was always a let down for me. 

i was lucky my e34 had a rack (525ix)

all good cars. I just think the e39 straddles the modern v usable classic best. 
 

But I would give drive way room for a 28/34/39/61

 

 

[Steve VH]

I would also take a rack and pinion over a steering box for feedback, the e34 being a weighty thing, coupled with steering box, and 15" wheels wearing balloon like 225 60 15 tyres, gave it a floaty feel, maybe the Sport was better, I had two e34 535i's at one stage, and the difference with the e39 is night, and day.